Switching over to Delta V control isn't working properly

Greetings All,

I have a very simple process where DV takes in level information from a tank radar and then controls a motor/pump speed that pumps product into that tank (the output is handled by a different motor/pump that runs at a constant speed).

Normally, we set everything up in manual mode, getting the motor speed right, getting the tank level up to nearly correct, and then we switch over to automatic, giving DV control of the motor.

When that happens, even if the tank level is slightly below target, the motor immediately slows way down, which then causes the tank level to drop. DV then speeds it way up, causing the tank level to be too high, then it slows way down, etc. It takes about 10 minutes for it to finally settle out. After that, it's fine.

DV is managing the motor VFD via an analog out signal to a voltage input on an Allen Bradley Powerflex 70.

The set up is a challenge, because the tank is actually quite small, so the difference between level too low and too high is only an inch or so.

It seems like the process isn't even looking at the radar signal upon switchover, it's just immediately sending the VFD signal low. 

Hopefully this is enough information to describe the problem, and someone has some kind words of advice for me.

Thank you so much

  • Seems like there are a few opportunities here. It sounds like a tuning issue but we need more information.
    Just few questions.
    1. What is the filter time on the analog input?
    2. Can we assume that switching from Auto to Manual is the DV Loop or is there other logic involved?
    3. How does the loop react after a SP change in Auto?
    4. After a step change, how long is the oscillation period, and the % overshoot?
    5. Is SP-PV track in Man turned on in Control_OPTS in the PID block?
    6. What is the execution time of the module?
    7. How fast does the VFD react to PID output changes in manual? What is the ramp up and ramp down times in the VFD?
    8. When the loop is controlling what % output is it at? Could be the valve is oversized.

    A picture of the PV, SP, and CV trends during a step change would be valuable for troubleshooting.
  • It sounds like a PID tuning issue. If you aren't familiar with how to tune, try using the deltav tune application, and certainly reading up on the topic. When switching from manual to auto, PID evaluates the pv/sp error , so when error is small the output should stay relatively stable unless your gain (p) is very high.
  • Is this a new control loop or a new issue on an existing loop?
    If it is a new issue on an existing loop, has there been any recent maintenance done on the VFD, just prior to the issue coming up?
  • Thank you all so much for replying. In researching the answers to your questions , I was able to really study the system and gain a lot of understanding (I didn't build the modules, we had an outside firm come in and do it). As it turned out, it was a large bit of operator error. We have 2 "manual" switches, one on a cabinet that manages a digital input to the VFD, and of course the one in the faceplate, that we weren't using. Also kudos to the guys at Control Soft, Inc. that wrote an article about bumpless transfer (www.controlsoftinc.com/.../) that very succinctly described exactly what the problem was. Thank you each again, each reply helped me find my way to the answer.