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Time synchronization between two DeltaV systems

We need to synchronize time between 2 different DeltaV systems.  Now, the existing DeltaV System A is already synched using external NTP (GPS) server.  Next, we are going to connect DeltaV System B to this existing system. We haven't decided if we use DeltaV Zone server or OPC connection between 2 Application stations.

The question is if we can use same external NTP server to sync both DeltaV systems. What is the best practice? Can we simply point to this NTP server from 2 different ProPLUS?

tasai
  • Youssef.El-Bahtimy
    Yes, you could, and should connect both DeltaV systems to your higher strata NTP server. I presume you also have a number of other systems synchonizing with that NTP server, and if not, add those too.
  • tasai

    In reply to Youssef.El-Bahtimy:

    Thanks Youssef. Does this still work if there is firewall between 2 DeltaV systems? Please note that existing NTP server is located inside the firewall of first 'DeltaV System A".
  • Youssef.El-Bahtimy

    In reply to tasai:

    Oh, I see. So that NTP device is dedicated to DeltaV A. Generally, you would need to ensure UDP Port 123 is allowed through the firewall. Is the NTP device on the 10.4 or 10.8 subnets? I guess you may be concerned that a node straddling the ACN of two DeltaV systems may cause problems.
  • tasai

    In reply to Youssef.El-Bahtimy:

    Yes, that is correct. Existing NTP server is dedicated to DeltaV System A, and it's on 10.4.0.x and 10.8.0.x range. I was thinking this may work as long as there is no IP conflict. If this arrangement will cause problem, we need to purchase separate NTP server for DeltaV System B.
  • Tracy Waller
    So, my Symmetricom S250 has LAN1, LAN2, and LAN3 ports. They are not connected. Simply put LAN1 on DeltaV system A and LAN2 on DeltaV system B.
  • Purnendu Saptarshi

    In reply to tasai:

    You might want to consider shifting the current NTP server to 3rd LAN or Plant LAN. This way you can use the same device on both of your networks without possibility of conflicts of IPs or even the Firewalls.

    Purnendu Saptarshi

    Automation Engineer | Skellig Automation US LLC | Greater Boston Area, MA

  • tasai

    In reply to Tracy Waller:

    Hello Tracy. What is the IP adress of your Symmetricom S250? Also, how do you connect DeltaV System A and B? Are you using Zone?
  • Tracy Waller
    My S250 is configured for 10.4.128.1 (See BOL topic for NTP Server - Reserved addresses). There is a KBA about configuring an S250, but I currently can't get search to work. Sorry.
  • Ben Bishop

    In reply to tasai:

    You do not need DeltaV Zones to synchronize two DeltaV systems with the same NTP server. Zones are used to exchange larger amounts of data between multiple DeltaV systems and to provide a common operator graphical interface across DeltaV systems. A graphic with I/O and logic in Zone A can be displayed (and optionally controlled) in Zone B's operator interface with the same graphic.

    The Symmetricom NTP appliance has three interfaces. In a single DeltaV system. you would typically connect two of the interfaces to the DeltaV Primary and Secondary ACNs. The third interface would optionally be connected to the third "Plant LAN" interface. You cannot connect the DeltaV ACNs between two systems due to IP conflicts, so you would need to decide which DeltaV system will have an NTP server available on two interfaces (DeltaV Primary and Secondary) and which one will have a single NTP connection on the "Plant LAN" interface.
  • tasai

    In reply to Ben Bishop:

    Thanks Ben. We will implement this approach.
  • Steve Linehan

    In reply to Ben Bishop:

    Ben

    Interesting, I thought the Symmetricon just did NTP broadcasts that were recieved by the ACN of the DeltaV system and used to sync the time. If there were multiple DeltaV systems in a plant I thought they could connect via routers to the same NTP. The router would translate the address from the internal DeltaV address to an outward facing address and pass on the NTP broadcast. I am not sure if this is supported but would like to know if anybody has done something like this before.
  • Rein

    But how about if the two DV systems are 40kms. apart, would it be better to have separate GPS Time servers?
    Will there be delays in minutes or seconds in data transfer between the Timeserver and the remote DV system with this distance?

  • fairchdm

    In reply to Rein:

    Depending on how critical your time synchronization needs to be, I would say "Yes" at that distance you need to separate Time Servers.

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